Looking for a new processor

[abstudios]

Hey all,

I recently built a PC for Photoshop mainlt, but I didn't do all the research I could have.... I went with an AMD X2 cpu, which is a good chip, but everywhere I read, people say Intel is the way to go for PS. I'm looking to swap my mobo and cpu for an intel combo. However, I want to know, based on your experience, is a dual core or quad core better (faster) for PS? My obvious choice is quad, but I want to really make sure before I do anything. Thanks!

[dcloud]

I just built a new system myself. After a lot of research I went with a Gigabyte P35-DS4 mobo and a Intel Core 2 Quad Q6600. The reason I picked the Quad is because I use large graphics programs like Photoshop and Illustrator and multitask with other programs at the same time. In the end I had a choice between the E8400 and the Q6600, but I figured for my needs and a $40 price difference it was better to go with the Quad.

[padiq]

Photoshop CS3 (latest version) does not actually take advantage of quad core. It may help in the running of multiple processes at once and there are a couple of applications out there which do take full advantage of the extra processor cores but if it is for Photoshop then I would go for the fastest Dual core within a reasonable price range. Have a look at the Intel E8500...

Remember that programs have to be written in a particular way so that they can take advantage of multiple cores. I believe PS CS3 does support dual core, but to be honest there is probably only a small portion of your application software which will be able to benefit from the extra core...

[orb of light]

Hi abstudios

I am runing 2 desktops that I have built my self, I would not bother to change your processor and motherboard. Your are not going to see that much speed difference, and most of the time would probably not even see the difference.

The bigest speed difference I find is the RAM, when I went from 2 Gig to 4 Gig in Vista I saw a good improvement.

Which AMD do you have, how much ram, which video card and which version of windows are you running (64bit?).

ORB :roll

[Hermie]

Origineel gepost door orb of light
Hi abstudios

I am runing 2 desktops that I have built my self, I would not bother to change your processor and motherboard. Your are not going to see that much speed difference, and most of the time would probably not even see the difference.

The bigest speed difference I find is the RAM, when I went from 2 Gig to 4 Gig in Vista I saw a good improvement.

Which AMD do you have, how much ram, which video card and which version of windows are you running (64bit?).

ORB :roll

These are some good points.... More memory and 64 bits....

[orb of light]

If you are looking to mainly run Photoshop, a 64bit version of windows is not currently so important as Photoshop still does not support it, so you will not get any speed improvement at the moment. Adobe has said that CS4 should be.

But 64bit edition of Windows means you can have more RAM so it is already worth using. 32bit editions are limited on the amount they can use, in vista its 4Gb.

Ram is very important and will make a large difference.

ORB

[Edited on 11-2-2008 by orb of light]

[abstudios]

Here are my system specs:

AMD X2 6000+ processor
8 GB GSkill RAM (yes, overkill, but worth it)
Windows XP x64
Nvidia 7600 grafix card

So, I should just stay where I'm at then? With all the RAM I have, things go pretty fast, but I'm always looking to go faster!

[orb of light]

Hi abstudios

Nice spec :cool:

Well you could go Intel Core 2 Quad Extreme Edition QX9650 and overclock it to 4.0GHz, but this would really be over kill.

As far as photoshop goes you are not really going to see any speed difference at the moment.

How much ram have you got on your Nvidia? And if you don't mind me asking why Windows XP instead of Vista?

ORB

[abstudios]

I think it's a 256MB DDR3 video card, if I remember right.... might be DDR2 though... can't remember.

I was looking at Vista for a long time, but read that CS2 (my current setup) won't run on it. Dunno how true that is, but I felt like being safe. Plus I want to wait until the bugs I hear about Vista are taken care of.

[mkeefe]

I always like Intel for processors and now being that I can find that in my Macs makes it even better. Photoshop will do better with a spare HD (scratch disk) than a larger processor. Also, when you add more memory be sure to go into preferences of Photoshop and allocate more to it.

In my current setup I have 6 gb of ram, 512mb video card, 2.1TB of storage and a gigabit local network.

Also, if you can spend it, by 10,000RPM or higher drives, you will be pleased.

Matt

[orb of light]

While your graphics card make no difference to Photoshop, if you upgrade to Photoshop CS3 Extended it will, but yours will handle the 3d just fine.

As for as Photoshop CS2 not running, that is completely wrong, there have been many misconceptions over the past year. It runs perfectly fine with no problems.

Vista has been out for a year now and is pretty much bug free, you could get an extra hard disk and dual boot. Best of both worlds.

Have you setup your scratch disk to a different hard disk yet? Apart from that I don’t know how you can really get any more speed out of Photoshop.

As Matt said you you can afford it look at a Western Digital Raptor drive 10000rpm, I use one for my Boot drive and another as my scratch disk.

I hope I have been of some help.

ORB

[Edited on 11-2-2008 by orb of light]

[mkeefe]

If you want to speed up Photoshop more enable "bigger tiles".

Matt

[Edited on 2/11/2008 by mkeefe]

[orb of light]

Originally posted by mkeefe
If you want to speed up Photoshop more enable "bigger tiles".

Matt

[Edited on 2/11/2008 by mkeefe]

Hi Matt, what does "bigger tiles" do?

Thanks

ORB

[abstudios]

I only have a 7200RPM 300Gb hard drive with everything on it, including the scratch disks. I was thinking of possible getting 3 10,000RPM HD's and setting up a RAID array for the scratch disks/ file storage. I kinda built this computer on a budget, so some things I left out for future upgrades. I did alot of research, just not enough apparently!

[mkeefe]

Adobe® Photoshop® CS3
Bigger Tiles Plug-In
The Bigger Tiles plug-in causes Photoshop to process image data in larger chunks. This will reduce the overall time to complete many operations, especially on computers with more than 1 GB of RAM installed. Bigger Tiles will also reduce the responsiveness of the application in some situations.

The Bigger Tiles plug-in is installed in the Extensions folder, within the Plug-Ins folder in the Adobe Photoshop CS3 folder. To activate it, rename it to remove the "~" from the beginning of its name.

http://kb.adobe.com/selfservice/viewContent.do?externalId=331372&sliceId=1 (works for CS3)

[orb of light]

Thanks Matt.

I will give that a try.

ORB

[Hermie]

8 Gb of memory!!! That is a overkill. XP supports 3,75 Gb of Memory. That's it. Vista supports (i think) 8 Gb.

:=offtopic: :( I'm still waiting on my mainboard........ :=offtopic:

[orb of light]

A bit out Hermie ;), XP 64bit Supports up to 16 GB of RAM, Vista is only 4Gb in 32bit edition and then it depends on which 64bit edition you have but upto 128Gb (now that really would be overkill!!)

Check out this Microsoft page for more information as to the 64bit edition of Vista: http://www.microsoft.com/windows/products/windowsvista/editions/64bit.mspx

ORB :roll

[Edited on 11-2-2008 by orb of light]

[dcloud]

Photoshop will take advantage of Quad cores, so just keep that in mind.

[Hermie]

Origineel gepost door orb of light
A bit out Hermie ;), XP 64bit Supports up to 16 GB of RAM, Vista is only 4Gb in 32bit edition and then it depends on which 64bit edition you have but upto 128Gb (now that really would be overkill!!)

Check out this Microsoft page for more information as to the 64bit edition of Vista: http://www.microsoft.com/windows/products/windowsvista/editions/64bit.mspx

ORB :roll

[Edited on 11-2-2008 by orb of light]

Thanx for the correction. I didn't check that first. My order is the Ultimate 64 bits version, because of the low dollar!! :D

All i need now is someone with a original photoshop cd that wants to update to CS2. He/ she could buy my upgrade version of CS2, so i can buy the upgrade version of CS3!! :(

AND someone in the States that would buy and deliver it..... Because photoshop is very expensive here in the Netherlands..... I'm just a hobby dude with an original version.

[bewerken aan 12/2/2008 door Hermie]

[orb of light]

Unfortuntly Hermie I don't have CS2 update, but do have a CS1 update I don't use any more, but with CS1 there was no way to deactivate it like in later versions.

So can not sell it :(

I buy the OEM version of Vista, much cheaper, and acording to microsoft its ok to use it, because I build my own systems! :roll Check out www.amazon.co.uk for prices of oem Vista.

ORB

[Hermie]

way :=offtopic: i bought it for €158, that's $233..... OEM box :=offtopic:

[dcloud]

I got an OEM version of my CPU (Q6600) because I am installing my own HSF; Thermalright Ultra 120 Extreme and Scythe 120mm 1600rpm fan. The Ultra120E is definitely a guy toy; large glorious piece of sculpted metal (drool). I also saved some $$$ and got an OEM version of Windows XP Home.

[orb of light]

Originally posted by dcloud
The Ultra120E is definitely a guy toy; large glorious piece of sculpted metal (drool).

Who can resist a hudge lump of metal that looks that good :cool:

Are you going to run the processor at clock speed or rev it up abit? That will be one fast computer.

Best way to build your own, been doing it for years now.

ORB

[dcloud]

Oh, and if you think the Ultra120E is sweet you should see my new case - the Ultra m998 (http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=2765147&body=MAIN#detailspecs). Gorgeous. I see now TigerDirect is offering a $40 rebate. Grrr....

I started out researching all my components about a month and a half ago, knowing that I wanted a machine with the power and efficiency to run large graphics programs and multi-task with other apps. I also wanted my components to be as future-proof as possible, so for a motherboard I chose the Gigabyte P35-DS4 (rev 2.1). My original choice for a CPU was the E8400, but many people suggested I bump that up to the Q6600. I did my research on this as well and it seemed that the Quad would offer more benefits in the long run than the Duo and for only $30-$40 more it was a no-brainer.

Since I was spending almost $300 on the CPU alone I wanted the best heatsink and fan I could find, and the best hands-down is the Ultra120E (http://www.heatsinkfactory.com/thermalright-ultra-120-extreme-cpu-cooler-p-16580.html). Don't take my word for it - just do a Google search on this HS and read the reviews. I paired this with the best fan I could find; the Scythe S-FLEX SFF21F (http://www.heatsinkfactory.com/scythe-s-flex-sff21f-120mm-silent-fan-1600-rpm-p-16400.html) 120mm Silent Fan (1600 RPM).

Of course all of this is pointless without a good power supply. Thankfully in my research I found this Official Tiered PSU List (http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?t=108088) and with this as a guide I picked out the PCP&C Silencer 610 (http://www.pcpower.com/power-supply/silencer-610-eps12v.html). This PSU is awesome. Well-built, heavy, a respectable brand, and with 49A on the one large 12V rail you won't have any power issues to worry about.

I have never OCed before, but with this set up I am definitely going to give this a "go".

[Edited on 2/12/2008 by dcloud]

[orb of light]

Hi dcloud

Very nice case and a sweet setup. That will really speed along, will you do any 3D on it?

My 2 setups are below, the first is an antec case with a 2.66 Core 2 Duo, 4Gb Ram 3 Western Digital Raptor drives (10000rpm each). 2 x ATI graphics cards.

The second is an older Pentium 4 running XP.


http://www.orboflight.com/cafe/comp1.jpg

My Photoshop and Cinema 4D Machine above.


http://www.orboflight.com/cafe/comp2.jpg

You will have to post a photo when you have it built I would love to see.

ORB

[Edited on 12-2-2008 by orb of light]

[dcloud]

I don't do 3D work. I would possibly with this new system since it will most likely be able to handle it better than my old one. My old system is a ASUS P4P800, Intel P4 2.4GHz with HT, Ultra X-Connect 500W modular PSU, 2GB Kingston PC3200, two SeaGate Barracuda 300GB SATA drives, Lite-On DVD burner, XP Home, and a $35 Radeon PC graphics card (my old GeForce FX5200 took a crap last summer).

You can see this current setup here:

http://img443.imageshack.us/img443/1599/x530bwv5.th.jpg (http://img443.imageshack.us/my.php?image=x530bwv5.jpg)

http://img210.imageshack.us/img210/8531/x530za7.th.jpg (http://img210.imageshack.us/my.php?image=x530za7.jpg)

I took these photos to use in an audio forum where they were helping me with my speaker arrangement. In one of the pictures you can see the m998 case in the lower left still in its bag. I'm going to give this system to my mom after I get my new one put together. I'm planning on taking pictures of the new rig as I build it so I'll be showing those off.

[Edited on 2/12/2008 by dcloud]

[orb of light]

Nice setup, your components are basically the same as my old rig, even the mother board is the same, except I have 2 raptor drives in it, 1 x 32Gb and the other 74Gb. Still have an Nvidia 5200 in it.

Look forward to seeing your new one as you build it. What monitor are you planning on using with it?

ORB

[dcloud]

Well, the one I have right now is a 19" HP f1905e. This is an excellent monitor and it will be my second one which I will mount to the side of the desk with a flex-arm. For my main monitor I've been looking at this CHIMEI CMV 221D 22" Widescreen (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16824252008).

[dcloud]

Well, here are all my "goodies" awaiting the arrival of the DS4 and a floppy drive.


http://img209.imageshack.us/img209/5195/goodiesyv6.jpg

[orb of light]

The heat sink looks small than it does in other photos i've seen. Looks very nice.

Havn't heard of CHIMEI before, I have a LG L226W, its good picture but the viewing angle is very tight, but it was cheap.

Look forward to seeing the rest when you are done.

ORB

[dcloud]

A friend of mine recommended the CHIMEI (he has three of them). They also get some pretty good reviews. I definitely want a decent LCD widescreen for design work. I'll use the HP as a dual for palettes and web viewing.

[PNeal]

Originally posted by dcloud
A friend of mine recommended the CHIMEI (he has three of them).

Why would someone have the need to have three 22" monitors?
Some people just have to over do it :P :lol

[abstudios]

I played around with 2 monitors the other day (mine and my wife's) and I gotta say, it was really fun. I had Illustrator on one and Photoshop on the other. I'm going to get another monitor when my budget allows for it.

I read about the bigger tiles plugin before, but didn't change it on my PC. I just did, so we'll see what happens.

Do you guys know much about RAID? I'm thinking of getting 3 Raptors to set one up, but I'm not sure if I should just use it for scratch disks, or if I can use it to store stuff. If scratch disks is all it's good for, I may go for 3 small HD's, and if not, 3 large ones. Any and all help is appreciated on this. Thanks!

[dcloud]

If you're going to do a RAID set up then just go with the smaller HDs. You can get Seagate SATA drives in 320GB and 500GB on Newegg for a decent price. Here's a great article (http://www.breakitdownblog.com/western-digital-raptor-or-seagate-raid-0-or-no-raid/) that explains about the drives (Seagate and Raptor) and RAID.



[Edited on 2/14/2008 by dcloud]

[dcloud]

My DS4 came today - I got the rev 2.1 board. Very happy. Took me all day to put everything together so I didn't get any sleep. That Ultra120E was a real nightmare to get on the board. I only hope I didn't mess up any Arctic5 application with that thing constantly sliding around. I'm at work now practically falling asleep on the keyboard writing this (ugh). BUT ... I am happy to report that everything works. Installed XP Home, booted right to the desktop, and no problems (praise God!).

Pictures forthcoming .....

[orb of light]

Originally posted by abstudios
I played around with 2 monitors the other day (mine and my wife's) and I gotta say, it was really fun. I had Illustrator on one and Photoshop on the other. I'm going to get another monitor when my budget allows for it.

I read about the bigger tiles plugin before, but didn't change it on my PC. I just did, so we'll see what happens.

Do you guys know much about RAID? I'm thinking of getting 3 Raptors to set one up, but I'm not sure if I should just use it for scratch disks, or if I can use it to store stuff. If scratch disks is all it's good for, I may go for 3 small HD's, and if not, 3 large ones. Any and all help is appreciated on this. Thanks!

The 2 monitors are great, and I find I can work quicker with this setup which is even more great. I use it for learning at too, I am currently learning Cinema 4D, so I can have it open on the main monitor with the training vids on the other.

I have thought about playing with raid in the past be have been a bit scared. But it is ment to be easy to set up so you could give it a try.

dcloud - looking forward to the photos, you will have to let us know how quick it runs, im betting super quick :roll

ORB

[dcloud]

Originally posted by orb of light
looking forward to the photos, you will have to let us know how quick it runs, im betting super quick :roll

The first thing I noticed was how fast programs open and close. No more waiting for explorer or files to open or looking at that stupid flashlight searching for something. There is some graphical lag, but that should be taken care of once I download and install the video card drivers. Normal operating temps - Core 1: 35, Core 2: 31, Core 3: 35, Core 4: 36.

I have to run Prime95 yet and check out my load temps, but so far it's light years beyond my old system.

[orb of light]

Sounds great, I found a huge speed difference from my old machine and still do.

The HSF apears to be working well, great temps on the CPU. Looks like you made no mistakes fitting it then.

ORB

[dogtrombone]

I have to run Prime95 yet and check out my load temps, but so far it's light years beyond my old system.

Yes, yes, but does it make pizza?:o

[dcloud]

No, but when I start the computer it says "Kowabunga, dude!"

[dogtrombone]

:lol
I was just leaving...

[dcloud]

Originally posted by abstudios
I'm thinking of getting 3 Raptors to set one up, but I'm not sure if I should just use it for scratch disks, or if I can use it to store stuff. If scratch disks is all it's good for, I may go for 3 small HD's, and if not, 3 large ones. Any and all help is appreciated on this. Thanks!

Right now Newegg is selling the Seagate Barracuda 250GB 7200 RPM SATA drives (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822148309) with the new 32MB cache for $80.99. A steal and a great way to get a few drives for that RAID setup.

[abstudios]

So after reading the article you posted, I'm a bit leary of setting up a RAID. I want more speed, but not at the cost of reliability. The way the guy was talking, every RAID array goes south at some point. Would it be good for scratch disks? That's basically temporary storage, correct? So if it's only temporary, if it crashes, I won't technically be losing anything, right? I'm intrigued, but want to do what's best.

[mkeefe]

You can set up redundant RAID, which is an array of drives that mirror the contents. It pretty much (unless a freak accident occurs) will protect your data from crashing and formatting errors.

If overall storage is your thing then invest in an SVN or CVS service/program because that is a versioning app that can save your a** some day when you lose a copy of something. :)

Matt

[orb of light]

Raid – you basically have 2 types, mirrored Raid 1 and stripped Raid 0.

Raid 1 - The mirrored is as its name suggests, mirrors all data from one drive to the other. Great for banks etc, but so much use for most people.

Raid 0 - Data is written to each drive in succession, each block going to the next available drive thus the data is distributed across the array drives (striping) providing faster operation and less chance that one drive will get overloaded with data requests. The volume can of course be much larger than any single drive. Since no redundancy is provided, the failure of a single drive will bring the system down. (as it would if you have a single drive)
Fastest and most efficient array type ideal for use in high-end machines used for graphics.

If you have high quality drives they will be less likely to fail, Western Digital Raptors are what is called Enterprise class, that me designed for business and carry a 5 year warrantee, plus they run at 10000rpm.

You would usually use the raid drives as your main drives for your operating system and programs, this will give you the greatest speed boost. The scratch disk is not so important so a single raptor is good, with a storage drive, a standard 7200rpm drive but large 500gb etc.

If you want to back all of your files up you can use an external drive and a program like, Memeo AutoSync - http://www.memeo.com/autosync.htm
I use this program my self and you simply select the folders you with to sync and where and every time you change a file it automatically changes the backup.

I hope this helps.

ORB

[mkeefe]

I HIGHLY dislike auto-backup (look for changes) be careful with that it will bite you one day.. why do you ask, because I have seen it happen. Photoshop one day decided to corrupt a file :mad: and the "auto backup" pulled it in.

The exception of course is incremental backup like SVN, Timemachine or Norton Go-back.

btw, it is Striped :)

Matt

[orb of light]

Hi Matt

Its a very difficult one with auto back up, good if something goes wrong with the machine, simply plug the external drive into another computer, but if something happens to the file you are ******.

Vista Business and Ultimate is good, with there own goback built in, but my old method of saving copies throughout the project is my favourate.

ORB

[mkeefe]

Look into SVN.. :) It saves a new "version" on each COMMIT.

I use it for all my projects no matter what size.

You use a simple command (terminal) line of code to create the project and on any update with TortoiseSVN or SCPlugin (mac) I am able to commit new versions.

http://subversion.tigris.org/

Matt

[abstudios]

So, from a speed standpoint, when it comes to PS, what would be my best bet? I'm thinking of maybe just getting another HD for scratch disks. I'm not really worried about storage space, as I have a 300GB drive as it is, and with everything I have on it, it barely reaches 70-80GB. I can always add more drives or an external HD if need be. I'm just trying to speed up PS a bit more.

[orb of light]

Thanks Matt.

I will take a look.

ORB

[dcloud]

I was never interested in RAID. To me this was just another newfangled gadget that failed more than it worked. For backup purposes I burn files onto DVDs, store them on an external eSATA drive or USB thumb drive, or simply on another HD. I always use a second HD as a scratch disc for PS.

[orb of light]

Originally posted by dcloud
I was never interested in RAID. To me this was just another newfangled gadget

I can remember seeing a friend many years trying to setup raid and it was a disaster. But now you can by laptops using raid, it should be quicker and most motherboards take all the guess work out of it. Asus calls it something like RAID for dummies, so I might give it a try sometime.

But at the moment I have 3 hard disks in each machine, 1 x Master drive, 1 x scratch disk and 1 x storage, and a usb external drive, as they say "if it ain't broke don't fix it, unless you have some free time :roll".

ORB

[dcloud]

Ok, like a proud Daddy I present pictures of my new baby :)

drum roll please .......

http://img90.imageshack.us/img90/5750/ultra2tu6.th.jpg (http://img90.imageshack.us/my.php?image=ultra2tu6.jpg)

http://img90.imageshack.us/img90/1038/ultra1up2.th.jpg (http://img90.imageshack.us/my.php?image=ultra1up2.jpg)

http://img90.imageshack.us/img90/1018/ultra4ml8.th.jpg (http://img90.imageshack.us/my.php?image=ultra4ml8.jpg)

http://img90.imageshack.us/img90/2941/ultra3ax3.th.jpg (http://img90.imageshack.us/my.php?image=ultra3ax3.jpg)

I was hoping for a little less cable clutter, but some of the connections on the board are in weird places. No modular PSU, but I don't really care about that. There are some power loss issues with modulars anyway, and the PCP&C Silencer makes up for this by being a solid workhouse.

Did some adjusting in the BIOS (turned off SmartFAN and changed setting to Voltage for 3-pin fans) now my core temps for Quad are 26/27/22/26

:)

[Edited on 2/14/2008 by dcloud]

[orb of light]

Originally posted by dcloud
Did some adjusting in the BIOS (turned off SmartFAN and changed setting to Voltage for 3-pin fans) now my core temps for Quad are 26/27/22/26


Great looking machine, and those temps, WOW those temps are really good, I knew that the new 45nm would help, but that is really good.

Whats it like to use, tried Photoshop yet?

ORB

[dcloud]

I'm still trying to get my front case fan to work. I tried plugging it into SYS_FAN2 and PWR_FAN, but neither works. So right now jus two fans are running; the rear one and the one on the Ultra120E.

[dcloud]

I ran Prime for a half hour and temps hung around 46/46/45/42. After an hour temps stayed at 45/45/43/40. That seems pretty good, but I haven't checked around yet to be sure.

[dcloud]

Had to open my case yeasterday to check if my fans were mounted correctly and I decided to organize the cables a little better. I've got some cable modding supplies on the way - black sleeving, extensions for the fans, and a nifty little Sunbeam MFPP Multi-Fan Power Port (http://www.newegg.com/product/product.aspx?Item=N82E16812195004).

Before:

http://img90.imageshack.us/img90/1018/ultra4ml8.th.jpg (http://img90.imageshack.us/my.php?image=ultra4ml8.jpg&s=1)

After:

http://img107.imageshack.us/img107/4993/ultraneatfb8.th.jpg (http://img107.imageshack.us/my.php?image=ultraneatfb8.jpg&s=1)

[orb of light]

Much cleaner, looking very nice now.

So how does it run, any problems?

ORB

[dcloud]

The only issues I've had are installing the video and audio drivers. I've spent the last two (sleepless) days trying to hunt down the answer and it wasn't until fifteen minutes ago that I found it. On a thread (http://forums.majorgeeks.com/showthread.php?t=148318) at MajorGeeks a member name musksnipe listed the steps to properly install the Realtek audio drivers, and it worked! The video drivers I was able to install after locating the most recent one on the Gigabyte web site.

The whole system seems to be working flawlessly. I haven't got too in-depth with OCing with these other issues happening, but I plan on it eventually. Right now idle temps on the Quad are 27/27/27/23. Some people were telling me that I had the fan on backwards on the HS. After studying several fan orientation diagrams and getting into my case to check on which way the fans are blowing I believe they are all installed correctly. It appears not everyone knows what they are talking about.

[orb of light]

If you have temps like that, the fan must be on right. Mine runs in the low 30's and goes upto the high 40's when rendering 3d.

I think I must be lucky with drivers the only time i've had a problem was with Vista (but I was installing it a couple of days before it was due out :D)

ORB

[dcloud]

And I discovered my fan was on backwards. Had the case up on the bench again yesterday working on a couple things and I decided what the heck and turned the fan on the HS around. Sure enough my temps plunged 4 degrees after I plugged everything back in.

[orb of light]

That must be one impressive HS if it cooled that much with the fan on backwards, I will have to think about changing mine.

How are you measuring the temps, via the motherboard?

ORB

[dcloud]

I measure the temps with a little utility called CoreTemp (http://www.alcpu.com/CoreTemp/). This small app runs in the taskbar down by the clock and reports the temps of all your cores.

[orb of light]

Sounds like a good app, but only works on core processors, but I only have one and it wont work on that one because its running Vista 64bit. :(

Have to wait for ASUS to bring out a working version of ASUS probe.

ORB

[dcloud]

CoreTemp works with ALL CPUs, regardless how many cores they have. I used to use the Probe on my old machine. OCed my 2.4GHz P4 to 3.2GHz.

[orb of light]

Hi dcloud.

Which version were you using with your old machine, I tried to use it and it said that I didn't have a "core" type processor.:( I took this to mean that it uses the new temp sensor in the coreDuo range.

If you had it running it was probably an old version, if so if you know which I would love to know so I can install it.

Thanks dcloud

ORB

[Edited on 20-2-2008 by orb of light]

[dcloud]

I need to know what type of CPU you have. Also, the Q6600 I have is a 65nm processor, not a 45nm.

[orb of light]

Hi Dcloud

I thought the new quads were 45nm, maybe it was only the extreme editions, I can not remember where I read it.

The processor was an old P4 the same as you had. Its a shame your can't properly run it under vista 64 bit.

Thanks

ORB

[dcloud]

There's a fix for CoreTemp and Vista here (http://forums.erodov.com/local_links.php?catid=18). Simply do a Google search for old versions of CoreTemp. I remember running CT on my old P4 2.GHz machine.

I have a Q6600 SLACR (version with G0 stepping), which is a 65nm CPU. My board (DS4) supports the new 45nm CPUs that are starting to emerge into the market. However, considering the price (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819115034) for new 45nm chips I thought it wise to buy a Quad 65nm now since that will do me good for quite a while, without breaking the bank account.

[orb of light]

Originally posted by dcloud
I have a Q6600 SLACR (version with G0 stepping), which is a 65nm CPU. My board (DS4) supports the new 45nm CPUs that are starting to emerge into the market. However, considering the price (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819115034) for new 45nm chips I thought it wise to buy a Quad 65nm now since that will do me good for quite a while, without breaking the bank account.

4 x the price in the UK at the moment between the Q6600 and the only currently available 45nm QX9650.

Worth the extra, NO way. I would love to have the money but the mortgage comes first. :(

ORB

[dcloud]

I know. I felt hugely guilty spending over a thousand bucks on this new system. If it hadn't been for the tax money it would have had to wait.

[orb of light]

My last system cost just over £1300, and it only took me 2 months to decide on the components.

I just spent £28, on a cover for my wacom, but I do take it with me, nd another £45 on ink, and i forget howmuch on paper, it all adds up to quick.

ORB

[Edited on 20-2-2008 by orb of light]

[dcloud]

I couldn't sleep so I did some cable modding this morning and plugged a few of my peripherals into that Ultra power bar. The power bar cuts down on a lot of the dangling cables I would have had to use and I was surprised when everything fired up because there are no instructions as to where to plug things in.

Here a pic of the cable job I did. Not the greatest, but it's better than it was before. I stuck my little Sunbeam multi-port on the power bar. Looks pretty cool.

http://webpages.charter.net/dwcloud/show/cablemod.jpg

[orb of light]

Hi Doug.

Whats this power bar, I have never heard of one in the UK.

ORB

[dcloud]

If you look in the picture I posted the Sunbeam multi-port is attached to the power bar - it's the little black thing with all the blue LEDs. You can get a better idea what it is by checking out this review of the case here (http://benchmarkreviews.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=120&Itemid=1). I think it's on the third or fourth page that he's starts talking about it.

Here's an excerpt:

"Here is Ultra's coup de grace regarding the m998, the Ultra Power Bar power distribution system. Intended to minimize cable clutter, increase airflow, and make cable management a non-issue. It's a simple matter of connecting your components via the Powerbars four Molex connectors using the included short Flex-force cables. For newer video cards that require a six or eight pin power connector, Ultra provides short eight pin Flex-Force cables to connect to, and from the Powerbar. Perhaps the greatest feature regarding the Ultra Powerbar is that it can be installed in any case that supports extended motherboards, providing the same functionality shown here. Sadly though it's not for sale on Ultra's website at this time, and the only way to get the Powerbar currently is through the purchase of an Ultra m998 case."

[Edited on 2/24/2008 by dcloud]

[orb of light]

Now thats a great idea, I have never seen any thing like it.

You might see more of this in the future. If you gould get matching power supplies, you could have all of the power connections hidden in the top or bottom of the case using a special connection, then connect from the bar.

I will have to keep an eye out in the future.

ORB

[dcloud]

Originally posted by orb of light
Now thats a great idea, I have never seen any thing like it.

That's odd. The Ultra m998 is very popular in the UK.

I was going to use my Ultra X-Connect 500W PSU, but then I found out that on the PSU Tier List (http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?t=108088) is was "not recommended". So I went with the PCP&C Silencer 610 instead. This is an amazing PSU, made by an old, established company with a heft that speaks of high quality. I'm glad I switched.

[orb of light]

Had a good hunt around on UK sites, but can not find it for sale anywhere. This is probably why I had not heard of it before.

The PSU I used in mine was FSP Epsilon, you can see a review of it HERE (http://www.overclock3d.net/reviews.php?type=3&id=72&page=1&desc=fsp_epsilon_700w_atx_psu)

ORB

[dcloud]

I guess I was mistaken on that. Sorry. A UK based company called Akasa has made a case similar to the Ultra m998 and that is the one that is very popular in the UK.

Here's a UK forum for the Akasa Eclipse 62 (http://forums.overclockers.co.uk/showthread.php?t=17671494)... their version of the m998. If you check out the pics in that thread you'll see how vastly similar it is to the m998. Here's the actual case (http://www.akasa.co.uk/) on the Akasa web site.

My bad ...

[orb of light]

That would be why I havn't seen the power strip, hopfully this will take on, it will really help.

I have used Akasa for many things in the past, they do some good case mods and cables, high quality.

ORB

[dcloud]

I decided to give my old computer desk and chair to my mom. I wanted her to be comfortable and not hurt her back or arms while she used my old PC. Spent the evening putting it together for her in the little nook off their living room. Now she has her very own little corner where she can sit and relax and surf the Web.

Of course I had to get myself a new desk so I plunked down a little over $500 for a dark walnut corner desk with two 3-drawer cabinets and a sliding keyboard tray. A nice solid outfit with the old antique brass fittings. Will look sweet with my new 22" widescreen monitor sitting on it.

:D

[Edited on 3/1/2008 by dcloud]

[orb of light]

That was nice of you, my sister and my self tried to get my parents to use a computer many times but gave up. They don't seem to get it. Yet my grandfarther was able to use one since they came out!

OK, whats the monitor, is it the CHIMEI you showed befor? 22" Widescreen is really nice, I find it so much easier to work using a wide screen.

I checked out CHIMEI and it looks like the UK does not have them.

ORB
.

[dcloud]

Originally posted by orb of light
OK, whats the monitor, is it the CHIMEI you showed befor? 22" Widescreen is really nice, I find it so much easier to work using a wide screen.

The CHIMEI is a consideration. However, now that I'm actively looking for another monitor I've discovered some other ones that I'm favoring more. I'm looking at some HP monitors because of the satisfaction I've had with the f1905e that I gave my mom.

The first one is a HP w1907 19" (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16824176077&Tpk=w1907) going for 229.99 on Newegg. I can also pick this up at my local Walmart for $228.00, which would also give me a good opportunity to check it out in person. The other is a HP w2207 22" (http://www.shopping.hp.com/store/product/product_detail/RK282AAR%2523ABA?) refurbished going for $249.99 on the HP site. There's also this DELL ULTRASHARP 2208WFP 22" which I have my eye on.

Lot of decent reviews on these monitors. However it appears many have issues with color, which isn't good in regard to graphic design work. I'm discovering a lot of monitors have similar problems. The only way to get away from this is to spend way too much than I want to spend on a high end monitor, especially since I've already dropped a wad on the computer desk. Backlight bleeding is another concern.

Another negative is these monitors come with built in speakers, which I think is pretty stupid. I see no point including speakers on a monitor.

[Edited on 3/1/2008 by dcloud]

[orb of light]

The whole monitor thing, I have spent many hours > Days > Weeks on this one. I would suggest the Dell if you can afford it new. Dell has it for $289.00 at the moment and as it comes with 3 years warranty as standard, it looks like the best one to be. Also its HDCP so you could play blu-ray through it in the future.

I do like the Dell Ultrasharps and they are usally my first choice if I can afford them. The 19" HP has a lower screen resolution, so not so goof there, and the 22" HP is refurbished, so I would not touch it.

Let me know what you decide.

ORB

[dcloud]

Ok, after an evening of exhaustive research I've discovered some very enlightening info. On the page, Buying a LCD monitor for photo editing, there is a very informative link to this site here (http://www.flatpanels.dk/panels.php), which will list the actual specs of any monitor you type into the search window. Going by the info in the section titled "Picking the panel" the best monitor for graphics work is an 8bit panel with a 8ms or higher refresh rate.

Check out the links. Very interesting stuff.

[orb of light]

Going by the info in the section titled "Picking the panel" the best monitor for graphics work is an 8bit panel with a 8ms or higher refresh rate.

Check out the links. Very interesting stuff. [/quote]

Doug this includes most monitors on the market - 8bit per channel is 24bit combined, and most support that.

The 8ms is not higher is better its lower is better, its how fast the pixels take to change, most new ones are 5ms now, but it does not mean that just because its a lower number that the monitor is better.

Have a look at:
NEC MultiSync Photo Edition (http://www.nec-display-solutions.co.uk/c/g/uk/en/Products/Details/Main/dp/Products/LCD/Current/LCD-2090UXi-PhotoEdition/LCD-2090UXi-PhotoEdition/index,group=all.html) I saw one of these the other day and this is the type of monitor I would like to get, designed for graphics. It just got 5/5 in Advanced Photoshop Magazine and only 2/5 in Computer Arts, this is what makes monitors so hard to choose.

If you really want a monitor for graphics, to give a accurate image you need to spend a lot more. One design studio I do bits of work for uses Eizo SX3031W's, very nice 30" monitors, but if you check http://www.eizo.com and then prices you will see why.

I am web and multimedia for the reason of cost, I can not afford the high end kit.

ORB


[Edited on 1-3-2008 by orb of light]

[dcloud]

Well until a large fat envelope of money falls out of the sky and lands right in my lap I'll have to settle for something less than stellar. I'm thinking of this HP w2007 (http://www.walmart.com/catalog/product.do?product_id=5683930), which is on sale at my local Walmart. This will also give me an opportunity to see the monitor before I make a purchase.



[Edited on 3/2/2008 by dcloud]

[orb of light]

I could do with a large bundel of money too. :D

The HP looks good, and the price is really good. I went for an LG for my main one due to the price http://uk.lge.com/products/model/detail/widescreen_l226wtq.jhtml

Its quite nice and has a very clear picture.

HP's seem to have a higher price in the UK.

ORB

.

[dcloud]

Did some more checking around and now I'm settled on this Dell UltraSharp 2007WFP 20" Widescreen (http://accessories.us.dell.com/sna/products/Displays/productdetail.aspx?c=us&l=en&s=dhs&cs=19&sku=320-4688), which is a 16 ms S-IPS (LG.Philips LM201W01/LM201WE2) panel. The IPS panels are recommended for graphic designers.

[orb of light]

That looks great :roll I have always liked the Dells but saw a review of there new ones and the quality has dropped, but so did the price. :(

But with the one you picked it got excelent reviews :D

Its always the same, a company brings out an excelent product, but given time decides they want to make more profit so they reduce the quality or remove features.

You will have to post a photo when you have everything set up.

ORB

[Edited on 3-3-2008 by orb of light]

[dcloud]

Ha, here's something humorous. Just as I was waking up I had a brilliant insight: hook up my TV to the computer and use it as a monitor. Duhhh....lol.

I have a second TV (an RCA 27") that I use when I play video games. Thankfully I have a Monster S-Video cable, which I used one time for my old DVD player. I always wondered what use a S-Video hook up was on a video card, well, now I know.

I wasn't sure this would work, but I hooked up the TV to the video card and viola! - online.

Well, now I can manage without a real monitor until I can afford one. :)

[orb of light]

Your getting as bad as me Doug, when Im looking for new components I go through loads trying to find the right one :D

Last time I built my PC it took 3 months to choose the components.

You are lucky where you are, the Acer over here is £249 thats just under $500 with current exchange rate.

ORB

[dcloud]

Well I discovered something disappointing today. I was wondering why my computer didn't seem to be the skyrocket I thought it was going to be; honestly speed-wise my old P4 2.4GHz CPU was about the same. To test this I opened a 29.3MB Photoshop file and it took just as long to open as it did with my old P4.

Puzzled, I started posting in some computer forums to see if anyone could tell me why the big QUAD didn't seem to be blasting me away like I had hoped.

The responses were quite disappointing. First, the bad news; I was told the Q6600 has a 1066 MHz FSB, while the Core 2 Duo CPU's use the 1333 MHz FSB.

Ugh...so much for believing what I was told by all the self-proclaimed "experts" who advised me that I should get a Quad.

So how to best utilize me new hardware? Learn how to edit video footage, design in CAM/CAD software, edit high-definition audio, contribute to the Folding at Home project, learn how to work with server technologies, enjoy multi-core optimized video games.

Great. None of those things do I plan on doing or am I even interested in doing. Oh well, no use crying about it now I guess.

[Edited on 3/15/2008 by dcloud]

[orb of light]

Hi Dcloud.

Try downloading this little Photoshop speed test. retouchartists.com (http://www.retouchartists.com/pages/speedtest.html) Its simply a set of actions and an image to apply them too.

Here are my results:

Pentium 4 2.8Ghz - 1Gb RAM - 800Mhz fsb - OS-XP 32 bit: 4:02

Core2 Duo 2.66Ghz - 4 Gb RAM - 1066Mhz fsb - OS-Vista 64bit: 0:36

Thats one huge difference, I also limited Photoshop to use the same amount of RAM as on the P4 and it only took 2 seconds longer.

Let me know what results you get?

Jason